I think she's wrong and that she doesn't know how to read ingredients or maybe she really believes that all this crap im Eukanuba and science diet ist great for dogs. Either way, she is wrong.

Stick with orijen or acana and take it slow when transitioning. Maybe you are feeding your puppy too much?? Remember with high quality foods you do not need to feed as much as with eukanuba for example.

 

The only "paid off" people in this situation are the people hosting the seminars your vet attended. I'm willing to bet that ever single one was funded by either Science Diet or Purina. These companies dominate the pet food market for one reason: marketing. They spend most of their money lying to vets and the general public, convincing people that their goods were full of meat and fresh veggies. FACT: most vets are given kickbacks to sell/promote Hill's food, aka Science and Prescription Diets. Half of these vets, don't even know what's IN the food! Not long ago I saw a vet site with a page on diet. It said not to feed did that was predominantly corn- and recommended SCIENCE DIET! Funny because corn is the FIRST INGREDIENT!

First five ingredients in Science Diet Adult Large Breed:
Whole grain corn, chicken by-product meal, soybean meal, animal fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), soybean oil

First five ingredients in Acana Grasslands:
Boneless lamb, lamb meal, salmon meal, herring meal, russet potato

Which sounds better to you?

 

in her opinion Orijen and Acana were low quality foods and Eukanuba and Science Diet were both superior.

Did she explain why Orijen and Acana are low quality foods? And why Eukanuba and SD are better? Does she sell Eukanuba or SD?

I would never feed my dogs Eukanuba or SD. Just read the ingredients... I've been very happy with Acana, great food!

 

What? WHAT?????

What is she selling in her waiting room? if she sells prescription dog food, she is "paid off" for sure. And i would bet it's Science Diet.

 

Wow. This sounds alot to me like the pot calling the kettle black type ordeal. Everything I've ever been told/read/researched and told by a few vets is that the things i think are "crap" in kibble, ARE. And vets have told me they get a percentage to reccomend those foods, and alot of people fall for it and thats why they push it. I was also told that the segment of "nutrition" they get in school is basicly a siminar about why to push this food more than what should be in it. I would ignore it and stick with the acana/orjin. Maybe try mixing the food with the old food until your pup is adjusted well? Good luck.

 

it's one thing for a vet to sell SD out of ignorance but it sounds like the vets u talk to are just a-holes.

 

It is so sad and frustrating that there is this extreme confusion with dog food. I'm not a professional dog nutritionist, but I've done my fair share of research, and I'm not saying just the opinions of people on this forum (though it has been a pretty good resource). I try to keep a very open mind, and not listen to bias opinions of people who are just in favor because other people are too. I've fed Orijen and Acana to my dogs with great results, I've seen friends and family switch their pets to Orijen and Acana with success and they'll never go back to the foods (Eukanuba, Purina) they were feeding prior. I've spoke with different trainers, a family that owns sled dogs/huskies, and even my vet, all who agree that Orijen and Acana are great foods.

My vet believes that Champion pet foods are a great choice. I actually left my last vet because I felt his knowledge was very narrow when it came to giant breed dogs (I had just adopted a Great Dane puppy, done a lot of research, and he didn't seem to know the different requirements a giant breed needed, so I went in search of a different vet), anyway my point here, that vet supported Science Diet and wanted to push it on me when my dogs had any type of ailment or itch it seemed "this will fix that, SCIENCE DIET!" I left. The vet I have now thinks Orijen is working great for my dogs, I didn't choose to stick with him solely on this, but he has a lot of knowledge when it came to Giant Breeds too so I trust his overall opinion. PLUS he told me that he sells Hills Prescription diet dog foods at their clinic, but he personally doesn't believe it's the best diet, he said "there are some situations where a dog does need a diet like Hills Prescription Diet, and it works well to fix certain ailments that dogs get, but it's not a life long diet, it's like a temporary medicine"...that really helped me understand, Science Diet has it's purpose, but it's not meant to be a diet. It's like getting an infection, and then receiving antibiotics, when the antibiotics are done, you don't go back and get more and take them for the rest of your life, it's temporary to fix a problem, THAT is how Science Diet should be used, not as an everyday diet. It's the same with doctors, some doctors take the approach of "you have Xproblem, this Xmedication I carry will fix it" instead of " you have Xproblem, if you eat more fruits and green vegetables that will fix your problem"...just different approaches, but I personally believe the second approach is more of a "natural health" way to do it.

I like to think of it this way. I'm not a "tree-hugger" but I do believe that there's so much going on in this world that people tend to forget where we came from and what is natural and healthy. Some people will argue that humans are capable of creating something BETTER THAN NATURE using science and studies (like Science Diet, it's backed by tons of studies proving that it's the greatest food for your dog), but when we look at wolves and their diet, we see that dogs are carnivores and need real meat to survive and most of all to THRIVE, not corn and grains. Ultimately I would grow my own fruits and vegetables, raise my own chicken and cattle, milk my own cows, make my own cheese, and grow my own wheat for making bread, I truly believe that is the way we were meant to live, and it's no secret that eating whole fresh foods is great for our bodies, why would dogs be any different? This is the approach I take to decide what's best to feed my dogs too, what is the most natural healthy way? How would they get what they need in the wild (aside from natural threats like limited resources/predators/natural disasters and such), they would eat fresh meat. How would we live without manufacturing plants that create processed foods? THAT is how it should be IMO.

Ultimately I think RAW is the ideal diet for dogs, people that feed their dogs a RAW diet are proving this all the time with the appearance, health and energy of their dogs. But this is the kibble section...sorry . My point here was that, even though I think RAW would be better than kibble, I think Orijen and Acana are better representations of food closer to a natural diet than a lot of other kibbles. It's probably the closest you can get to feeding RAW without actually feeding RAW, still a processed kibble, but much better than some out there.

Dogs that get the runs on Orijen are probably being overfed, it's a very rich food, but still some dogs cannot handle it, and will always get the runs from it, in that case I've seen those people switch to Acana and have no problems with it. A lot of people prefer Acana to Orijen. I feed both.

Good luck. Whoa...I blabbed a bit here, sorry!

 

PLUS he told me that he sells Hills Prescription diet dog foods at their clinic, but he personally doesn't believe it's the best diet, he said "there are some situations where a dog does need a diet like Hills Prescription Diet, and it works well to fix certain ailments that dogs get, but it's not a life long diet, it's like a temporary medicine"...that really helped me understand, Science Diet has it's purpose, but it's not meant to be a diet. It's like getting an infection, and then receiving antibiotics, when the antibiotics are done, you don't go back and get more and take them for the rest of your life, it's temporary to fix a problem, THAT is how Science Diet should be used, not as an everyday diet.

I so agree with this. A vet that pushes ONE single food has to be getting something from selling it or has been brainwashed. A vet that is open to do what is best for the dog (or even, God forbid, consider the opinion of the dog owner) is a vet I'd like to have.

I gave a foster dog canned S/D once for bladder stones. The foster group told me it was only temporary because a dog could not sustain life on Science Diet. After reading the ingredients, I wondered how she could sustain life for six weeks. The stones did go away, but they returned and continue to return. My pleas to put her on raw food were ignored.

So yes, I think something like S/D can be a band-aid - but does it really help in the long run? I'm not so sure.

 

Her response was that most of the reviews online are made by "paid off" people and most people do not understand how to read dog food ingredients.

sorry, but I had to laugh at that one, what a load of crap. She should be pointing the finger at herself. I have yet to see champion bribing anyone or having it heavily advertised at every clinic, funding vet classes or give out coupons and samples at dog shows and expos.

 

Orijen doesn't need expensive marketing, bribery.. it sells itself based on ingredient lists and people's results. :smile:

 

Rocky came from the rescue with a bag of Science Diet because that is what they got for free. I switched him to Orijen Large Breed Puppy. Remember, they need a LOT less of it then you'd think or they will get diarrhea. When he hit 75 pounds, he only got 2 cups a day of it. And he still grew and did great. Any more then that and he would get the runs.

My vet had never heard of Orijen but I didn't care and never listened to them. They had a wall lined with Science Diet and Hills products.

 

Hey guys, thanks for all your wonderful input. I tend to agree with what all you are saying, I'm no nutritionist but even I can tell just by reading the ingredients that Orijen or Acana are far more superior to Eukanuba and the likes. I've never noticed my vet selling any food at the clinic but it would make sense that she was brainwashed at the seminars. I'm sticking with Acana for now.

 

I'm no nutritionist but even I can tell just by reading the ingredients that Orijen or Acana are far more superior to Eukanuba and the likes.

Which did your puppy do better on? Eukanuba or Orijen?

I think you're changing foods way too much. What food did the puppy come to you on?

 

How bout some pics of your pup I have French mastiffs, but I love all mastiff breeds...I mean what's cuter than a mastiff puppy??

 

Answer: A Pug puppy.(.

 

I'm not sure what he was eating when I got him but I put him on Eukanuba and he did fine, then I switched to Orijen and it gave him loose stools and diarrhea, yesterday I switched him to Acana but he's still got diarrhea, really not sure what to do

 

Are you switching him cold turkey, because that could definitely cause diarrhea. You want to switch dog foods gradually.

 

You should have done a slow switch with the food, mixing in the Eukanuba with the Orijen, 75% Eukanuba to 25%Orijen slowly increasing til it is all Orijen and no more Eukanuba. Do this with the Acana, if you don't have any Euk left just give a very little amount daily until the stomach upset is back to normal. DO NOT overfeed as this will cause liquid poo!

 

From what I understand, the amount they tell you to feed on the dog food bag is often way, way too much.

 

I did switch him cold turkey from Eukanuba to Orijen and now I've switched him cold turkey to Acana, there doesn't seem to be any point in mixing it with the Orijen as that was giving him diarrhea regardless. I gave him 1 cup of Acana this morning and half a cup this evening and he just squirted on my floor :Cry:

 

Well, going back to the original post, all I can say is that I'm still waiting for my cheque from Orijen/Acana. Must have been lost in the post.

 

Acana is a great food, can you please post up the ingredients that you are feeding here! It very well could be different where you are..

 

I agree. Switching him cold turkey could definitely have caused the upset stomach. If you ever switch food again in the future (unless it is raw) cold turkey is not the way to go. Some dogs can handle it but I have never had a dog who could handle a cold turkey kibble switch.

I agree with everyone else here. Orijen and Acana are way healthier than Eukaneuba or Science Diet. If I were in your position I would be finding a new vet. I don't think anyone should have to put up with a vet who makes them uncomfortable or doesn't listen to the owner of the pet they are being paid to see.

 

This is just a thought, but I do have to ask for my own peace of mind. Going by your post, you are from Israel right? Do they irradiate food that is imported into your country?

 

I will post the ingredients a little later, I'm a bit busy at the moment. The funny thing is she is considered to be one of the best vets here in Israel. She treated my last Bullmastiff who sadly died of lymphoma but regardless she did a wonderful job. Maybe she's just completely ignorant when it comes to nutrition or maybe she knows something we don't.

 

I really don't think it's the latter!

A vet can be great at diagnosis, treatment, etc and yet so many are not great at nutrition, even though most will act like they are.

 

I have no idea if they irradiate food here.

 

Acana Puppy Large Breed Formula

Chicken meal, steel-cut oats, deboned chicken, whole potato, peas, whole egg, deboned flounder, chicken fat, sun-cured alfalfa, chicken liver, herring oil, pea fiber, whole apples, whole pears, sweet potato, pumpkin, butternut squash, parsnips, carrots, spinach, cranberries, blueberries, kelp, chicory root, juniper berries, angelica root, marigold flowers, sweet fennel, peppermint leaf, lavender, vitamin A supplement, vitamin D3 supplement, vitamin E supplement, niacin, riboflavin, folic acid, biotin, vitamin B12 supplement, zinc proteinate, iron proteinate, manganese proteinate, copper proteinate, selenium yeast, dried Enterococcus faecium fermentation product.

 

Do you know which Eukanuba you were feeding so we can compare the ingredients

 

Large breed puppy