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Do you know of dogs with HD in the wild? When it comes to HD and dogs genetics is merely a scape-goat. It stems from feeding carnivores omnivore nutrition. Mr. Purina and Mr. Hills want to believe it is genetics to protect profitable omnivore diets. Don't let them think for you. You're smarter than that....nature DID NOT get it wrong.

HD has a 85% heritability factor, which means that 85% of the HD cases seen in the dog population were inherited (ie passed on from their parents). I learned this from a text book in COLLEGE, not from something that I read online or from Mr. Hills or Mr. Purina. A peer reviewed book I might add, with pages and pages of references and scientific results. So you see? I had no other reason to learn this stuff other than passing the class(es)...with all A's I might add.

The front page on your website doesn't even include resources...so what I get from that is that its all what they CLAIM to be true with NO backup whatsoever. They give you a description of the "feeding program" (they can't legally say study since there is no peer review) but they do not include the conditions of the hips of the parent dogs to begin with. How are you supposed to know if the parental generation did or did not have HD (they don't even say)? They just tell you that the food gets rid of the problem.

If thats not marketing propaganda then I don't know what is. There is a reason that this food is not a major brand dog food (not necessarily backing any major brand of dog food here, just making a point)...because they would be slaughtered by the media by their claims. There are way too many educated people out there that would call this company out (probably already have).

Please. Do yourself and eveyone else here a favor and get your information somewhere else other than the internet.
 

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First you accuse me of saying things I didn't and then when called on it you throw it back on Abady and not your lack of comprehension...


No worries. I'm not saying Abady is a BAD food BUT nothing beats RAW meat, bones and organs...
Who started pulling quotes off of Abady magical website claiming BS and lies? We all read the post. Isn't it obvious Abady is comparing their raw diets to the rest in the industry, not to your processed meats you purchase? But you slam the company anyway accusing them of lining their pockets with market bull...so where are they lying...I always ask that question but never seem to get an answer.
 

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Who started pulling quotes off of Abady magical website claiming BS and lies? We all read the post. Isn't it obvious Abady is comparing their raw diets to the rest in the industry, not to your processed meats you purchase? But you slam the company anyway accusing them of lining their pockets with market bull...so where are they lying...I always ask that question but never seem to get an answer.
I also accuse them of lies...read my last post and you will see.
 

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HD has a 85% heritability factor, which means that 85% of the HD cases seen in the dog population were inherited (ie passed on from their parents). I learned this from a text book in COLLEGE, not from something that I read online or from Mr. Hills or Mr. Purina.

Did your college text book tell you the diets fed to mothers? Were they raw fed dogs by any chance? Nope, I will not believe it. If they were fed properly they would have had puppies with text book perfect hips. Genetics and HD is just one way the industry attempts to protect itself in keeping with profitable diets (omnivore diets). Hey I went to college as well, Class of '84!
 

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Did your college text book tell you the diets fed to mothers? Were they raw fed dogs by any chance? Nope, I will not believe it. If they were fed properly they would have had puppies with text book perfect hips. Genetics and HD is just one way the industry attempts to protect itself in keeping with profitable diets (omnivore diets). Hey I went to college as well, Class of '84!
The many books and studies I had to read used all the different variables, which includes properly fed parents, or raw (takes more than just a properly fed mother to make puppies with perfect hips, right?). I cannot recall one specific study...it's been a few years since my last genetics class.

May I ask if you have read the same claim anywhere else other than on the Adaby website? And if so can you please show me where?

So you are telling me that the dog food industry is taking control of every biology, genetics, ecology, etc class?! Just so they can control what all the students are learning in college? Seems a bit far fetched to me...

Ever used wikipedia?

I'm happy that you went to college. But I can just tell by the way you think that you did not major in biology or even science.


Economics, helps bring the costs down for the consumer.
So...I thought you said that white rice is better nutritionally for the dog? Not for the consumers pocketbook...
 

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I also accuse them of lies...read my last post and you will see.
Well, I guess everyone thinks Abady is just BS and lies. I don't. I think they are the only company actually hitting you with the truth, and all the rest lie to protect their profitable omnivore nutrition.
 

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So you are telling me that the dog food industry is taking control of every biology, genetics, ecology, etc class?! Just so they can control what all the students are learning in college? Seems a bit far fetched to me...


Are you trying to tell me we should study dogs the same as people? Everything you learn in regards to genetics, biology, etc., the same also applies to us applies to carnivore dog? I don't think so.
 

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Well, I guess everyone thinks Abady is just BS and lies. I don't. I think they are the only company actually hitting you with the truth, and all the rest lie to protect their profitable omnivore nutrition.
You seem very confused about what I am trying to debate with you. In no way am I saying that it's a horrible food out there. Just plainly asking you to back up your statements with something. Seems like you just disregard what I'm trying to discuss with you... Which I must say does NOT help your arguement. Just makes you seem that much more clueless.
 

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Are you trying to tell me we should study dogs the same as people? Everything you learn in regards to genetics, biology, etc., the same also applies to us applies to carnivore dog? I don't think so.
Yes. There are principles you adhere to when it comes to researching things. These apply to anything you happen to be studying. And where did this comment even come from?! You are WAY off base here...
 

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So...I thought you said that white rice is better nutritionally for the dog? Not for the consumers pocketbook...
Nutritionally, no, even Abady will tell you the only contribution white rice can give is carbs, and should be kept to a minimum. Is it nutritionally better or I should say safer than beet pulp...yes, stingbeans...yes...dandelions...yes tomato pomace yes...garlic...yes, soy...yes, gluten...yes, flaxseed...yes...etc, etc, etc. White rice is a safe ingredient for dogs, unlike the toxins people are paying for in even those high end kibbles. Is the ideal ‘economic’ ingredient for dogs.
 

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I think I'm done trying to debate with you about this since it's obviously one sided.
The problem is that we aren't debating CB, we are debating Abady marketing department. CB has absolutely nothing to say that isn't in their promotional material. I think we won this debate weeks ago, CB just doesn't realize it yet. :smile:
 

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The problem is that we aren't debating CB, we are debating Abady marketing department. CB has absolutely nothing to say that isn't in their promotional material. I think we won this debate weeks ago, CB just doesn't realize it yet. :smile:
Hey, I have science on my side. And it is not complicated science. HD happens across all breeds lines and across the country. What does this tell you? How can it be anything but food caused? Hey thumbs up to all you raw feeders, you're doing the best thing for your pets. But you don't even comprehend the power your diets and their capability to sustain life without the need for medical intervention. Yes, when dogs are fed appropriately you can wipe out HD within your dogs over time. How can that not be so? It is omnivore nutrition that has created all the problems with our pets.

It is the 'nutritional gap' that must be overcome created by commercial omnivore nutrition . Abady tells you there are 3 ways to achieve this (overcome the nutrition gap). The gap is created by diets seriously deficient in animal source proteins.

A) Feed Abady diets that are species-appropriate carnivore rations, the only in the market place.

B) This is what you folks do (raw feeders). Feed home-prepared meat based rations.

C) Attempt to overcome the nutritional gap with the appropriate vitamin supplementation.

That's it, you have 3 options to beat the nutritional gap created by commercial omnivore nutrition. Breakdowns like HD are a product of omnivore nutrition. They have interests to protect and profit. Yes, they will simply blame in on genetics. Keep in mind, HD happens across the country and across breed lines...genetics. Don't blame omnivore nutrition, it must be genetics. Come on, do you really believe that? Mother Nature is that bad and screwed up all these animals hips? Genetics? No, am I not buying that at all.

All you folks offer to the debate table is that food stinks and it's marketing BS, and don't even realize the power behind the raw diets you feed and what they can accomplish. I can all but guarantee you this, have mothers yield pups that have been raw feed, the pups will have perfect hips. And when good nutrition continues with the pups, and their pups, so on down the line, you got HD beat. It is no mystery what causes these problems with our dogs. They (the industry)want to make it a mystery.

I understand your skepticism. It works. Its logical. Feeding dogs very well eliminates a lot of problems. I know it all sound very bizarre, but it works. Abady diets are designed to overcome that nutritional gap created by commercial omnivore nutrition.
 

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A) Feed Abady diets that are species-appropriate carnivore rations, the only in the market place.
Which is about 50% refuse from human chicken processing plants and 50% grain.

B) This is what you folks do (raw feeders). Feed home-prepared meat based rations.
Not exactly "meat based". More like 100% animal source meat, bones, and organs.

C) Attempt to overcome the nutritional gap with the appropriate vitamin supplementation.
Haven't given a dog a vitamin in 7 years.

Don't blame omnivore nutrition, it must be genetics. Come on, do you really believe that?
Yes absolutely and I can prove it. Read this study Genetics of canine hip dysplasia. [J Am Vet Med Assoc. 1997] - PubMed Result

If you want more, I can produce many other studies that prove the same thing. I haven't seen you produce any studies to back up your claims. You can't even produce Abady studies. Wonder why?

Mother Nature is that bad and screwed up all these animals hips? Genetics? No, am I not buying that at all.
Doesn't matter if you buy it or not and it's not Mother Nature that screwed up, its poor breeding by humans. I suspect mostly by show breeders with their "line breeding" and other questionable practices.

All you folks offer to the debate table is that food stinks and it's marketing BS, and don't even realize the power behind the raw diets you feed and what they can accomplish.
Their food is relatively good. Just not the best. Their marketing is BS. And ... Are you crazy?? We are the ones feeding a raw diet, many of us for years. We see the results every single day. I can't believe you could make a statement like that. :smile:

Abady diets are designed to overcome that nutritional gap created by commercial omnivore nutrition.
They are designed to sell dog food ... nothing more. They are a grain based highly processed product that has been liberally labeled as dog food.
 

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Hey, I have science on my side. And it is not complicated science.
You do? What science is on your side?

Let's compare sides here...

Hip Dysplasia is genetic -

^ Canine hip dysplasia

^ Osteoarthritis: canine and feline (cat and dog) veterinary factsheets
Osteoarthritis: canine and feline (cat and dog) veterinary factsheets

^ Ettinger, Stephen J.;Feldman, Edward C. (1995). Textbook of Veterinary Internal Medicine (4th ed. ed.). W. B. Saunders Company. ISBN 0-7216-6795-
Book sources - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

^ Pitcairn, Richard H.; Pitcairn, Susan Hubble (2005). Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs & Cats. Rodale. ISBN 9781579549732.
Book sources - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

^ Hip Dysplasia: canine and feline (cat and dog) veterinary factsheets
Hip Dysplasia: canine and feline (cat and dog) veterinary factsheets

^ Arthritis in the Dog

^ Terry DE, Rees-Milton K, Smith P, Carran J, Pezeshki P, Woods C, Greer P, Anastassiades TP. (2005). "N-acylation of glucosamine modulates chondrocyte growth, proteoglycan synthesis, and gene expression". J. Rheumatol. 32 (9): 1775-86. PMID 16142878.
N-acylation of glucosamine modulates chondrocyte g...[J Rheumatol. 2005] - PubMed Result

^ Canine hip dysplasia

^ "BioScaffold Reduces Pain and Lameness in Dogs with Osteoarthrits: July 2009 Report".
http://www.trmatrix.com/uploads/OsteoArthritis_Study_TRBIO_71509.pdf

I'm happy to find more for you although I know it won't change anything because you're so brainwashed by the Abady marketing department.


Hip Dysplasia is caused by poor diet (omnivore diet)
http://therobertabadydogfoodcoltd.com/

and....???


HD happens across all breeds lines and across the country. What does this tell you?
Ummm.... it tells me that it's a SPECIES related issue. Why

Hey thumbs up to all you raw feeders, you're doing the best thing for your pets. But you don't even comprehend the power your diets and their capability to sustain life without the need for medical intervention.
You've gotta be kidding me... that's WHY we're feeding RAW. We know it's the best thing for our pets AND we KNOW the POWER of the diet (why else would we deal with all of this raw meat?

Breakdowns like HD are a product of omnivore nutrition.
See above in the post. I have science on MY side. You have a marketing department

All you folks offer to the debate table is that food stinks and it's marketing BS
At least we're addressing your side of the issue. You just continue to side step our side ignoring what's said so you can just push your agenda

It is no mystery what causes these problems with our dogs.
You're right. It's poor breeding that's made it such an epidemic. Thank goodness we have science to show us something concrete like genetics, not just some website that is trying to sell dog food.

Feeding dogs very well eliminates a lot of problems.
Now this is something we can agree on. Feeding a RAW diet of meat, bone and organs CAN eliminate a LOT of health problems dogs & cats are seeing these days. That's VERY easy to see...

My wolf hybrid has hip dysplasia. Unfortunately even a RAW diet won't help her hips get better. She's not going to enjoy a long and pain free life like our Great Danes are. Fortunately I'll do everything in my power to make sure what life she does have she enjoys and gets the best nutrition available to her (NOT processed commercial dog food like Science Diet, Purina, or Abady)
 

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All you people have in regards to genetics are industry connected veterinarians protecting the industries profitable diets. You folks are the used car salesman's favorite customer.

They even write doctoral thesis of benefits of kibble and how it cleans teeth. Yes, I'm sure you all believe that one as well, especially if it was written by a veterinarian.

And you think I'm the one who is gullible....lol.

Cheap profitable omnivore kibble diets will be protected by the industry, and they do that with skewed studies and test results, including HD and genetics.

Remember, across all breed lines and across the country, but don't whatever you do don't blame the food. Wake up people.
 

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Guess what, same stuff different day.

You have your theory supported by your dog food's marketing department. That's it. We're supposed to believe that EVERY scientific study is skewed by the dog food companies YET we're supposed to trust the marketing materials of Abady blindly...??

Til you can back it up with something aside from your gut feeling I think I'm done here

You refuse to address the point in ANY of our posts. You just continue spewing the same crap from post to post.

Have fun & enjoy. Just remember that RAW meat, bones, and organs are the best thing you can feed your pets! :)
 

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All you people have in regards to genetics are industry connected veterinarians protecting the industries profitable diets.
CB, you obviously didn't follow the link in my last post. It was a SCIENTIFIC study of a group of GSD's and how HD was reduced in them through selective breeding. I assume they ate kibble throughout the 5 generation study. So if genetics play no part, how were they able to breed out the HD while on the same diet????

You are out of options now, CD. You have lost. Admit it. :smile:

BTW: I originated the used car salesman angle months ago and used it on you. HAHAHAHAHA Obviously you forgot. :smile:
 
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