[future]

I know this is not about nutrition, but hopefully someone will have some good ideas:

A female friend of ours (who's not too internet savvy)will be getting a 3 year old female Rottweiler from a breeder shortly. Neither we or she has seen the dog but, through very reliable sources, this is the information we have:

She is a very "soft dog" (for a Rottie) - very sweet, gentle and well trained, with titles in both novice and advanced Rally-o. She has very low prey drive, but is highly protective, with a very high defense drive. She does well with kids, friendly people and friendly dogs but, as sweet as she is, she will absolutely not back down from a threat.

In the area in which we all live, there are a fair number of aggressive, poorly trained and behaved dogs. Fortunately, most are usually on lead.

The problem is that our friend is not very large, and is concerned that if, when passing by one of these dogs on a walk, and he snarls and lunges her way, her new girl will react. She's never owned a protective dog, and is concerned that she doesn't want to have to physically restrain her new girl.

She wants (and needs) the protectiveness, and doesn't want to change this quality in the dog. Assuming everything we've been told is correct, any ideas? (She asked the breeder, and didn't get answers to her satisfaction.)

Thank you!

 

[rannmiller]

I'd recommend that the very first thing your friend does is take this dog to the best positive trainer in town and attend some classes to forge and strengthen her bond with this dog before attempting anything else. This dog will probably not listen to her most of the time from the very beginning, that is why training classes are so important; it will teach your friend how to handle the dog and get the dog used to listening to your friend, this way they can both grow to respect each other.

In the mean time, I would not recommend for your friend to take this dog on many outdoors excursions. If she has a fenced yard where she can play with the dog for a couple of hours for exercise, that would probably be best until she is more comfortable with the dog. And of course, this will also help build up their trust of each other and form a relationship.

Your friend should only take this dog out in public if she is confident she can control her, otherwise she is a dangerous threat to everyone she encounters with her.

However, once they have established their relationship and the dog has learned to respect and obey your friend, I'm sure she will have a fantastic friend and guardian. Good luck!

 

[RawFedDogs]

Neither we or she has seen the dog but, through very reliable sources, this is the information we have:

First let me say that I agree with what rannmiller says. Let me add a few things. The only reliable sources are your own eyes and time with the dog. I can't tell you how many times I've seen dogs described as vicious, or dominant, or aggressive only to find a very playful dog when i see them in person.

The problem is that our friend is not very large, and is concerned that if, when passing by one of these dogs on a walk, and he snarls and lunges her way, her new girl will react. She's never owned a protective dog, and is concerned that she doesn't want to have to physically restrain her new girl.

My gut feeling is that if she thinks she may not be able to handle the dog, she probably can't. Again, a visit and a chance to play with the dog and handle it some will tell her a lot.

She wants (and needs) the protectiveness, and doesn't want to change this quality in the dog. Assuming everything we've been told is correct, any ideas?

Again, my experience says that if she can't handle this protective dog, she won't be able to handle any that actually has the capablilty of protecting.

After all that. If she really wants to get this dog after she has spent some time with it, I suggest she get a Gentle Leader head harness. The GL is not the answer to her problems but it will be a great help to control the dog until they both go to some classes. I have never seen a dog that I couldn't handle with a GL with one finger but I am a pretty big pretty strong man.

If I had to bet, I would bet this dog is not as bad as described. That has usually been my experience. However if, after spending some time with this dog at the breeders, she is afraid of the dog, don't even consider taking it home.

 

[PeanutsMommy]

why does she want this dog sight unseen?
why is the breeder giving up this dog?

rawfedogs

i have the gentle leader harness for my male american pit bull terrier and at first by the way it looked i was skeptical but it is amazing! i am 5'3 106 and i walk him2 times a day and i can walk with him holing his leash with 2 fingers and no problems. the only thing with it is it rubs my boys fur on his front legs but i sewed on some fleece and it seems to be helping

 

[BoxerMommie]

I have to 2nd the Gentle Leader head harness. It took my female when we got her from rescue, she was pulling my arm out of the socket pratically, she's EXTREMELY strong (I call her "bulldozer" half the time) when she wants to be and it got to the point that i finally gave her to my husband and I took our other dog (who was trained) until we could deal with it because I was afraid she was going to pull me down and run off, or seriously injure my arm. We stopped by PetSmart on the way home to get a new leash, collar, etc and the trainer there recommended the Gentle Leader, I'm not kidding you, within just a few minutes of having it on my 4 year old could have walked her it was THAT huge of a difference. I'm 5'2 and around 140 pounds and I've not had any problems with any dog using the GL. Highly highly recommend the head collar, AWESOME tool!

 

[prntmkr]

...
She is a very "soft dog" (for a Rottie) - very sweet, gentle and well trained, with titles in both novice and advanced Rally-o. She has very low prey drive, but is highly protective, with a very high defense drive. She does well with kids, friendly people and friendly dogs but, as sweet as she is, she will absolutely not back down from a threat....

Working from the assumption that everything you’ve heard about this dog is true, this sounds like it could be really wonderful dog!

From personal experience, here’s another possible take on the situation, just in case:

With what you’ve described:
a friendly and sociable dog who has low prey-drive, high defence-drive, and a sound background in obedience, it’s quite possible that your friend’s Rottie won’t drag her down the street, kicking and screaming after dogs who seemingly pose a threat...

It’s quite possible she will stand guard, positioning herself between your friend and the possible aggressor. With her “very high defence drive” and “very low prey drive”, it’s likely that she’ll want to stay close to your friend and defend her, rather than running off and leaving her vulnerable.

Having said that, I’d highly recommend passing on the other advice offered as well. Chances are that, without breaking the dog's spirit, she'll never change the dog's basic instinct to be on guard. But it would certainly be best if she can learn to harness and control that protectiveness.

I wish your friend the best of luck with her new guardian!

 

[EnglishBullTerriers]

Working from the assumption that everything you’ve heard about this dog is true, this sounds like it could be really wonderful dog!

From personal experience, here’s another possible take on the situation, just in case:

With what you’ve described:
a friendly and sociable dog who has low prey-drive, high defence-drive, and a sound background in obedience, it’s quite possible that your friend’s Rottie won’t drag her down the street, kicking and screaming after dogs who seemingly pose a threat...

It’s quite possible she will stand guard, positioning herself between your friend and the possible aggressor. With her “very high defence drive” and “very low prey drive”, it’s likely that she’ll want to stay close to your friend and defend her, rather than running off and leaving her vulnerable.

Having said that, I’d highly recommend passing on the other advice offered as well. Chances are that, without breaking the dog's spirit, she'll never change the dog's basic instinct to be on guard. But it would certainly be best if she can learn to harness and control that protectiveness.

I wish your friend the best of luck with her new guardian!

I will have to agree with everything you have said. I have a Neo Mastiff/Pitt mix and he is the same way and he is only 5 months old. The one thing I do with him is, when I don't see the threat to be as dangerous as he does. I tell him, 'Thank you, were ok. Thats enough.' He will now stop after he feels that his job is done and he will sit next to me and wait for everything to get back to 'normal'. He will also be sure to stay between me and anything that he feels as a threat.
My EBT is the same way and I don't want to change anything about them. That is why I got them. They are my security system. At the same time they are both the biggest love bugs to those they do not feel threatened by.
Good luck with your dog!

 

[RawFedDogs]

Chances are that, without breaking the dog's spirit, she'll never change the dog's basic instinct to be on guard.

Define "breaking the dog's spirit" and how would you go about doing that?

 

[rockymtsweetie82]

Just from reading this thread, the Gentle Leader sounds like it is exactly what I need! China is constantly pulling so hard that her prong collar chokes her and she hacks but still won't back down, continuing to pull. She only does that when she sees another dog but still I'm afraid she's going to choke to death! I'm going to buy that GL next week!!!

 

[rannmiller]

Are we talking about the head collar or harness?

 

[RawFedDogs]

Are we talking about the head collar or harness?

I am talking about the head harness. I suspect PeanutsMommy is talking about the body harness. Both are good products. I have only played with the body harness a little so I'm not THAT famiar with it.

 

[BoxerMommie]

Are we talking about the head collar or harness?

Well I was talking about the head collar, however someone else mentioned the harness. I only use a harness to seatbelt my dogs into the car, otherwise I use the GL head collar.

And RawFed mentioned the head collar.

 

[rockymtsweetie82]

What is the difference? I know the harness must wrap around the chest, but I don't think I've ever heard of a head collar.

 

[BoxerMommie]

What is the difference? I know the harness must wrap around the chest, but I don't think I've ever heard of a head collar.

Here's a picture of the head collar

AOL Search

It goes around their muzzle and then comes around the sides of the face and behind the ears and that's where the buckle is, you then attach the leash to the piece that hangs down underneat the muzzle. It's kind of like a bridle on a horse, but without going into the mouth.

 

[rockymtsweetie82]

Oh I see. And this works better than the harness? How would that work on a very hyper/aggressive dog in public? Would I hve to get a regular muzzle to go along with that?

 

[BoxerMommie]

Oh I see. And this works better than the harness? How would that work on a very hyper/aggressive dog in public? Would I hve to get a regular muzzle to go along with that?

A harness does not control their head, and IMO typically makes them pull more, however I've never seen or used the gentle leader harness so for that I couldn't say.

On a muzzle well does your dog bite? If your dog is a bite risk or has bitten people or other animals in the past then I would muzzle your dog anytime it is off of your property for not only safety reasons but for liability reasons as well. But the head collar doesn't use a muzzle if that's what you're asking. I'm kind of confused on your question.

On controlling them it controls their head and is a psychological issue more of a physical one I believe.

 

[TippysMom]

One of the doggie trainers that I spoke to said that the head (gentle leader) is better if they're bad on a leash. Dogs power being in their neck/shoulder/chest area - it takes the pulling power away by using their head/face as the control point. Our Schnauzer was a pain in the butt on a leash - but she's a dream on the gentle leader (first time out!).

If they bite you'll need the muzzle, not the gentle leader. Not sure if you can combine the two....

 

[rockymtsweetie82]

She doesn't bite but the way she projects herself, I'd rather muzzle her for the safety and liability in it. She's terrific on leash until she sees another dog. Which is when she starts lunging and pulling and choking herself to get to them. People she's usually fine with (except our female neighbor, whom she hates for no reason that I can fathom). I understand the difference between the two now though, thank you.

 

[BoxerMommie]

She doesn't bite but the way she projects herself, I'd rather muzzle her for the safety and liability in it. She's terrific on leash until she sees another dog. Which is when she starts lunging and pulling and choking herself to get to them. People she's usually fine with (except our female neighbor, whom she hates for no reason that I can fathom). I understand the difference between the two now though, thank you.

Well the way the head collar is designed she won't be able to choke herself and it would be hard for her to pull or lunge as well.

You may want to pick one up and give it a try. If it doesn't work you can return it.

 

[RawFedDogs]

She's terrific on leash until she sees another dog. Which is when she starts lunging and pulling and choking herself to get to them.

You should get the book Fiesty Fido by Dr Patricia Mcconnell. It will help you with this behavior.

Yes you should get a GL and try it out. You definatley can take it back if you choose to. I don't think you will.