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Well it was going great for the first week and I thought we had finally licked Sophies IBD; she was eating great, and had firm poo and no vomiting. Then yeaterday she had extremely bloody and mucusy diarea and vomiting. I got her to eat enough of her Blue Buffalo canned venison stew to take her antibiotics and she feels much better this morning but still not eating yet. I am keeping the other two on raw seeing as they are doing so well on it. I have ordered Sophie a bag of Natural Balance duck and sweet potato in hopes of getting a long lasting "well" period. She had the longest well time on BB fish & sweet potato(about 2 months).
 

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Even healthy dogs that are newly switched will have occasional diarrhea and/or vomit particularly if they are on antibiotics. It's no big deal and easily fixed. You are making a big mistake putting her back on kibble which caused the problem to begin with. Prey Model Raw is the absolute best thing you can feed an IBD dog. It is much easier to digest than any other food there is. Even my wife who has IBD can eat any meat she wants but some veggies and most fruits give her real problems. You can't buy a kibble with no veggies.

Just because she has one bout of diarrhea/vomiting doesn't mean she is not doing well. Give it a chance. Don't panic at the first set back.

What did you feed her before her set back and how much did you feed? IBD dogs usually need smaller more frequent meals when switching. This is not a difficult problem to fix.
 

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This has been an ongoing problem. I know that I wont change your mind but you cant fix EVERYTHING with a raw diet. I agree whole heartedly that it is the best diet you can feed a dog UNLESS it is making them ill. Sophie isnt just having diahrea, she is pooping nearly straight blood and mucus. I have been stuggling for months to get this under control and the only luck I have had is with fish and duck. The kibble is NOT what made her sick, her body did, her problems are not the grains in the kibble, it is with her body attacking the protiens as they enter her gut like they attack disease. She is most likely most allergic to the protiens in chicken and I cannot afford to buy duck for her, nor can I spend my days fishing for her. I really wanted this to work for her but it didnt and I have to do what I can to make her as healthy and COMFORTABLE as I can. I am despereatly trying to keep her off of a prescription diet but that is where a lot of dogs with this disease end up. IBD is a terrible condition not to be confused with IBS.
 

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Important to give Probiotics with Antibiotics

Hi,

I read you are giving your dog antibiotics. Because the antibiotics will kill the good helpful bacteria in their system you need to give them probiotics also. I'm currently giving Nutri-Vet from PetSmart because it was reasonably priced but there are lots of really good high quality versions out there and once my dogs are off the antibiotics I'll likely restock with another brand so that they are getting a well rounded set of probiotics. They suggest giving it for 4 weeks after the antibiotics end.

Good luck to you and your dogs overcoming the digestive issues.

Michelle
 

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It could have been a detoxification. I know my dogs went through a vomiting and mucus covered stools around three to five days after starting the diet. I dont recall blood in my dogs stools, but there might have been some. I would look up the detoxification process to see if thats what it was.

Dogs that switch to raw typically show signs of improvement first, then the symptoms return worse then they were before. That is because the body is dealing with them, fighting them. This is mistaken as a bad reaction to the diet, when in fact it is the main reason for going on the diet.


http://www.drpitcairn.com/books/pitcairn_book.html
The link goes to the book that explains a ton of information about detoxification. Dr. Pitcairn isnt my favorite holistic vet, but he is correct about this process. I recommend trying to find the book in the library or buying it if you want to. Based on what I have read, it was worth the buy.
 

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This has been an ongoing problem. I know that I wont change your mind but you cant fix EVERYTHING with a raw diet.
No it won't fix everything but it certainly will fix IBD.

I agree whole heartedly that it is the best diet you can feed a dog UNLESS it is making them ill.
The raw diet is not what is making your dog ill. She was ill long before beginning the raw diet.

Sophie isnt just having diahrea, she is pooping nearly straight blood and mucus.
While that can be upsetting to someone not expecting it, it is really not a big deal. It is easily fixed.

The kibble is NOT what made her sick, ...
Oh, it is THE VERY cause of her problems.

her body did, her problems are not the grains in the kibble, it is with her body attacking the protiens as they enter her gut like they attack disease.
That is probably true but it is the plant proteins, not the animal proteins that cause the problem. Grains aggravate it also.

She is most likely most allergic to the protiens in chicken and I cannot afford to buy duck for her, nor can I spend my days fishing for her.
Most likely not. A dog being allergic to animal protein is like a cow being allergic to grass. It just almost never happens.

I really wanted this to work for her but it didnt and I have to do what I can to make her as healthy and COMFORTABLE as I can.
Give it a chance. You haven't done that yet. You tried it one week and then after one little incident, you panicked and stopped.

I am despereatly trying to keep her off of a prescription diet but that is where a lot of dogs with this disease end up. IBD is a terrible condition not to be confused with IBS.
My wife has IBD. I know all about it. Of course she is not on a raw diet either. hehe
 

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I have almost watched this dog bleed to death from the rectum and retch until she had no energy to stand so PLEASE stop trying to be her savior and my educator when you know NOTHING of mine or her personal battle with this. She is back on a grainless kibble, has finished her antibiotics and is doing great. I have continued to feed raw to my other two because it is working well for them. Just as I would not force a lactose intolerant child to drink milk just because its good for them; I will not force a diet on my dog that causes her pain and misery.
You have a lot of very good info and are very passionate about what you believe and that is great but you are crossing the line from passion into fanaticism. Most people if not all dislike being preached at and being talked down to. You will reach many more people with your information if you would sound a bit less like you are shoving it down their throats.
 

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... so PLEASE stop trying to be her savior and my educator when you know NOTHING of mine or her personal battle with this.
I know more about your situation than you think I do. I know IBD. I know what it is and what it does. I also know the canine digestive system and how it works. I know that raw meat and bones are much easier on the digestive system than any kibble with or without grain. There is nothing you could feed your dog that is harder to digest than kibble. Difficult to digest things are not what you want to feed.

Do your own research and you will come to the same conclusion. If you don't want to be educated, fine. I am just trying to help. I understand your frustration with your dog. It can be very unsettling to have a dog with such serious problems.

I will not force a diet on my dog that causes her pain and misery.
There are a lot of treatments for a lot of physical ailments that may cause pain and misery and a raw diet may cause the same for your dogs temporarily until her digestive system adjusts to real food, and it will adjust. There is no physical ailment that a dog can have that will benefit more from feeding a diet of highly processed artificial food than from a diet of meat, bones, and organs. Artificial food just doesn't make sense anytime.

Do what you want. It's your dog but you are shooting the messenger. The message is correct.
 

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You have a lot of very good info and are very passionate about what you believe and that is great but you are crossing the line from passion into fanaticism. Most people if not all dislike being preached at and being talked down to. You will reach many more people with your information if you would sound a bit less like you are shoving it down their throats.
I have to agree with this. I think this exact same thing every time I read your posts. Great info, but it would be more helpful if you toned it down just a bit. Just my opinion.
 

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I completely agree. You are definitely very knowledgeable when it comes to dogs but you do sound very condescending at times. I understand that the raw diet is better for dogs, and yes...that is how nature intended them to be. But things have changed. Just because kibble isn't as good as raw does not mean that it is bad. I have had a few dogs and my last one passed away at 17, completely healthy, just from old age. Nature didn't intend for humans to eat deep fried, oil cooked McDonald, but they do. Now, if you are also on the Raw movement of only eating unprocessed food, then I suppose I cannot make a case haha.

Perhaps people will be more grateful for your knowledge and opinion if you didn't attack everyone. You seem to get very offended and defensive if someone does not have the same opinion as you on their dog's diet.

Threedognight...I'm glad that your baby is doing better and wish you both the best.
 

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If you have decided to take her off raw, I think Blue Buffalo is a very good choice to feed if she does well on it. I am not an authority by any means, but I did hear (and I am sure someone could confirm or deny) that you should not combine raw and kibble because of food poisoning because of the food mixing and then going bad - so I would be very careful since your other 2 babies are on raw. I feed my dogs Avoderm kibble and Blue Buffalo canned. They are doing great! Their stools are fine - they only get dirrahea when they steal catfood from our kitty! Good luck to you!
 

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I completely agree. You are definitely very knowledgeable when it comes to dogs but you do sound very condescending at times.
The things I say, I say with confidence and always set aside emotion and speak with logic and reason. If this comes across as condescending, it is only in the eyes of the reader. As long as it's factual, logical and reasonable, you shouldn't try to put something in it that isn't there.

I understand that the raw diet is better for dogs, and yes...that is how nature intended them to be. But things have changed.
As far as feeding dogs a highly processed grain based cereal, yes things have changed but not for the better and dogs haven't changed nutritionally in hundreds of thousands of years.

Just because kibble isn't as good as raw does not mean that it is bad.
If you study the ingredeints in kibble, learn where they came from and learn about the manufacturing process, you would change your mind on that statement.

I have had a few dogs and my last one passed away at 17, completely healthy, just from old age.
I had a grandfather that lived to be 86 and smoked up to the day he died. That doesn't mean smoking didn't cntribute to his death.

Nature didn't intend for humans to eat deep fried, oil cooked McDonald, but they do. Now, if you are also on the Raw movement of only eating unprocessed food, then I suppose I cannot make a case haha.
Yes, I eat fried food and McDonalds 1/4 pounders and french fries and other fast foods. It doesn't mean that they aren't slowly killing me.

Perhaps people will be more grateful for your knowledge and opinion if you didn't attack everyone. You seem to get very offended and defensive if someone does not have the same opinion as you on their dog's diet.
I get offended when I present facts and people ignore them mostly because they refuse to think outside their little box or because they choose to follow the easy path. I rarely give opinion. When it's opinion, I label it as such. I present facts.
 

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Well, in case you haven't noticed, your approach isn't working. I get turned off every time I read one of your posts. Which is a shame, because I do think you have a lot of knowledge and a lot to contribute, but at the rate your going no one is going to be interested in reading anything that comes from you.

The things I say, I say with confidence and always set aside emotion and speak with logic and reason. If this comes across as condescending, it is only in the eyes of the reader. As long as it's factual, logical and reasonable, you shouldn't try to put something in it that isn't there.




I get offended when I present facts and people ignore them mostly because they refuse to think outside their little box or because they choose to follow the easy path. I rarely give opinion. When it's opinion, I label it as such. I present facts.
 

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RawFedDogs...your response to my post obvious made my point even stronger. You say that it is in the eye of the beholder, but already 3 of us have asked you to tone it down.

You state that we are in our own bubble, but obviously you are also in your own bubble. You are always right and only you. Your way is the only way because apparently you know everything and if anyone else disagrees, we're wrong.

I love this forum, I truly do but I do dread reading any post that includes you.
And almost everything does. I love the knowledge everyone shares and I respect everyones opinion, but I don't like one man thinking he knows everything.

Admin, I would suggest you ask him to tone down before you lose more members.
 

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You are always right and only you. Your way is the only way because apparently you know everything and if anyone else disagrees, we're wrong.
I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me particularly if they have some kind of evidence to back up what they say. If I make a statement and no one presents evidence that I'm wrong, then I must be right. People like nothing better than to prove me wrong and I respect them when they do.

I love the knowledge everyone shares and I respect everyones opinion, but I don't like one man thinking he knows everything.
But whether or not that knowledge is accruate doesn't bother you? I don't deal in opinion or feelings, only facts. Sometimes people don't want to hear the facts. Often they know the facts but don't want ot admit them. I don't know quite everything yet but I do know a heck of a lot about canine behavior and nutrition. I've had years of experience and have confered and worked with the most notable experts in both fields.
 

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I would just like you to acknowledge that maybe not everyone wants to feed raw. And that you should respect their decision. Kibble is not as bad as you say it is or the entire world would be feeding raw. Majority of dogs do well on kibble.

You're so into what nature intended for dogs to eat. Well nature intended for them to hunt for their own food. Do your dogs hunt for their own raw meat? After all, thats what nature intended.

I'm bored at work so I keep coming back here, but it is my last post. It's like talking to a wall and I do not need to annoyed due to one guy ranting on a dog forum.

Good luck everyone else!! Boxermommie...thanks for all your advice and I appreciate everyone else that helped. =)
 

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Do your dogs hunt for their own raw meat? After all, thats what nature intended.
Actually they often do. The pretty regularly kill rabbits and squirrels. My cats kill those two species plus rodents and birds. The dogs always eat their own kill. The cats do sometimes but sometimes they just eat a portion of it and leave the rest. Sometimes I think the cats kill just for the fun of it. Sometimes they don't eat any of it. Almost every day, I find parts of animals or whole dead animals or sometimes its just a stomach and intestines laying around my property. Thats kinda how I monitor how much they are getting. I think over half the cats diet is wild kill. The dogs are probably closer to 10%.

I'm bored at work so I keep coming back here, but it is my last post. It's like talking to a wall and I do not need to annoyed due to one guy ranting on a dog forum.
Stick around, I guarantee you'll learn something. :)
 

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I would just like you to acknowledge that maybe not everyone wants to feed raw.
Just because someone doesn't want to does not meat it's not best for the dog.

And that you should respect their decision.
I respect decisions to do what is best for the animals.

Kibble is not as bad as you say it is or the entire world would be feeding raw.
They have been taken in by the hype from the dog food companies. They have been convinced that dogs are omnivores and they are taken in by the pictures of healthy ingredients on the bag. Of course the ingredients in the bag look nothing like the picture. They are also taken in by the name of the products themselves. Names like "Wellness", "Nautral Choice", and all the other fancy names given my marketing departments.

Majority of dogs do well on kibble.
Thats an arguable statement what with all the allergies, IBD, IBS, diarrhea, skin conditions, cancer, kidney problems, liver problems and all the other diseases that didn't exist until about 30 years ago.
 

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You may come off like you're attacking people or being condescending, but I'm so used to dealing with people like that, I've come to be more amused than annoyed by it. Maybe more people should try to understand that you can't always convey attitude and tone of voice over typed messages on a forum (not to offend anyone on here, believe me!). Because as it was previously stated, this is a dog forum for fun and the exchanging of ideas, knowledge and advice.

Anyway, Rawfeddogs, I love hearing what you have to say. You're extremely knowledgeable and after reading how passionate you are about the raw food diet and having the points reiterated over and over again, and doing even more research on the matter, when I run out of my kibble I have now I plan on switching over to raw and sticking with it despite how broke I may be and the fact that I get my kibble for free *sigh*

I know it's for the best and will ultimately save me loads of money on added supplements, vet bills, etc in the long run. Oh and my roommate is going to switch her dog over with me despite her parents thinking it will murder her dog on site to even look at a raw chicken drumstick.
 
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