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Discussion Starter #1
Hello,

finally I made the switch To raw (chicken quaters with backs) and in few days I noticed much reduced stool quantity (I was worried at first) and solid too as never my puppy ever had. I noticed that her eye's discharge have been reduced to normal.
I am so relieved!

I have my doubts about using supplements and I hope you can help me, since I cannot have a constructive conversation with my vet about raw feeding.
I haven't fed any fish yet, nor I am planning soon. Should I give her supplements? I happen to have a bottle of flaxseed oil pills (1300mg) that I purchased from costco. If that ok to give it to het what would the ideal quantity per day be? I read somewhere that also vitamin E should be administated in conjuction. And once I start feeding her raw fish should I continue giving her supplements?

Thank you
 

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I have my doubts about using supplements and I hope you can help me, since I cannot have a constructive conversation with my vet about raw feeding.
Unless your dog has a health problem that could be helped with supplements, there is no need to give any supplements with the prey model raw diet other than possibly fish oil (preferably salmon oil) for their Omega 3's. Flasxeed is a plant and there is no need for that. Fish oil is far superior. Don't worry about vitamin E. There is plenty in the diet.


And once I start feeding her raw fish should I continue giving her supplements?
I don't give any supplements and haven't for 7 years and I rarely feed raw fish. I usually feed canned salmon once a week or so.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Unless your dog has a health problem that could be helped with supplements, there is no need to give any supplements with the prey model raw diet other than possibly fish oil (preferably salmon oil) for their Omega 3's. Flasxeed is a plant and there is no need for that. Fish oil is far superior. Don't worry about vitamin E. There is plenty in the diet.




I don't give any supplements and haven't for 7 years and I rarely feed raw fish. I usually feed canned salmon once a week or so.
Thanks for your reply.

Salmon sounds good. Do you mean something like bumble bee in water? And would you serve that as a whole meal? For a 70lb dog how many of those cans should I give her?
Sorry if I sound naive, but it's barely my first week in raw feeding.

Thanks again
 

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Unless your dog has a health problem that could be helped with supplements, there is no need to give any supplements with the prey model raw diet other than possibly fish oil (preferably salmon oil) for their Omega 3's. Flasxeed is a plant and there is no need for that. Fish oil is far superior. Don't worry about vitamin E. There is plenty in the diet.
Omega 3 fatty acids are plant derived in the first place. Guess where the fish get the omega 3's that is stored in their bodies? Algae and phytoplankton. Fish cannot produce omega 3's so they get it in their diet which is plant based. So dogs will use that planted based omega 3's they get from eating fish, or fish oils.

Flaxseed oil is the richest source of omega 3's...doesn't matter if they are a "botanical" source considering we are talking about the fatty acids within the oil.

Dogs will use the fatty acids the same way regardless of their source.

So...the flaxseed oil caps you have would work 100% fine with your dog :wink:
 

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Thanks for your reply.

Salmon sounds good. Do you mean something like bumble bee in water? And would you serve that as a whole meal? For a 70lb dog how many of those cans should I give her?
Sorry if I sound naive, but it's barely my first week in raw feeding.

Thanks again
Salmon is the best "fish" source of the omega's you're looking for, but its expensive. Canned mackarel, sardines, anchovies and tuna will do as well, considering the daily amount needed in their diet will easily be covered by feeding those. Fresh fish is even better. We rarely give canned fish any longer now that we feed fresh fish, give it more like a treat or snack.

If you can find a local meat distributing company that will let you order in bulk, you could order some whole, raw fish for a reasonable amount (cheaper than feeding the canned stuff!).

Remember, you want as much variety in their diet as possible, as soon as their bodies are able to handle it.
 

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For a 70 lbs dog, you'd probably want to feed two cans of salmon or mackerel once a week once you get further into the raw diet (like in another two weeks or so).

You don't really need to supplement unless your dog has a health problem. For example, I give my dogs glucosamine and chondroitin with MSM pills for their joints since I run them a lot and my older dog is starting to show some signs of joint discomfort every now and then.
 

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About those joint supplements... I was advised that they are not a good idea for young dogs. Is that true? Also, are glucosamine & condroitin necessary for a raw fed dog? And if both answers are yes, at what age is it okay to start?

Thanks!
 

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About those joint supplements... I was advised that they are not a good idea for young dogs. Is that true? Also, are glucosamine & condroitin necessary for a raw fed dog? And if both answers are yes, at what age is it okay to start?

Thanks!
Is there a reason you are giving them? I gave my dog Emmy, who has the worst case of HD know to man LOL, when she was a puppy and I still do. She has grown up just fine, and the vet that I took her to at the time said it was perfectly fine to do so. I have heard that it is bad to give puppies glucosamine/condroitin, but I don't believe it.
 

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There is glucosimine naturally in a prey model raw diet. Any animal part that has bone a bone joint and connective tissue has it.

I am not real big on glucosamine given in supplement form. I had two Goldens that had hip dysplasia and I, myself, had a severly arthritic hip. I gave large doses of glucosimens, controitin, and MSM to both dogs and to myself for several years. I could tell no difference in their behavior nor in my own condition. My wife said she thought the dogs were doing better on it but I think it was just wishful thinking. I could not tell any difference in my own hip after taking the supplements for a couple of years and then stopping it. The thing that helped my hip was a complete replacement.

After saying that, I have a 9 1/2yo Great Dane now with one bad hip and I give her 3,000mg of glucosimine daily. Go figure. :smile:

To answer your question, it won't hurt your puppy.
 

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I think that dogs and people the same have different tolerances for glucosamine/condroitin. It helps some and doesn't with others. I think this can be applied for pretty much any supplement.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
It has been a week or more since i switched to raw.*
I am amaized by the size of the poop. It's actually easy to pick up. I haven't seen any mud as I was accustomed before raw. Actually the poop is nice and dry, not white by any means, but almost like big olives. It that the ideal? I have been giving her exclusively chicken leg quaters with back.*

I am about to start feedinng different proteins. Perhaphs turkey necks.*
Also, how to feed the egg? My dog has quite a beard and a liquid egg would be messy... What if I cook it slightly?

Thank again for your suggestions *
 

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On Saturday nights, my dogs get a mush made up of canned salmon, a glob of beef liver, a raw egg and sometimes some chunks of beef heart. All that MIGHT be messy for your dog but thats how I do it.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
On Saturday nights, my dogs get a mush made up of canned salmon, a glob of beef liver, a raw egg and sometimes some chunks of beef heart. All that MIGHT be messy for your dog but thats how I do it.
Ahaa, I see. I haven't though of mixing it with something else.
Good suggestion.
I may try with some ground meat.
Thanks
 

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Ava and Casey loves their slopped up eggs, salmon and liver.

The girls find liver much better mixed with salmon and eggs and slightly frozen. :biggrin:
 
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Fresh Fish?

Fresh fish is even better. We rarely give canned fish any longer now that we feed fresh fish, give it more like a treat or snack..
What type(s) of fresh fish do you recommend ordering/feeding? I'm *assuming* the fish bones are included in this? Or not? We're not at the fish stage yet of raw (chicken is going awesome!), but definitely interested when we reach that point. I just don't know what to/how to properly order it from our local butcher.

Thanks!
Amy J-K
 

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What type(s) of fresh fish do you recommend ordering/feeding?
Fatty fish is good. So something like mackerel would be a wonderful addition. You could also go with sardines or smelts. But really, most any fish you can get a good deal on is great to feed with few exceptions. I will not feed fresh salmon due to Salmon Poisoning Disease. Fish with the SPD parasite have typically only been found in the Pacific Northwest, but I'd just rather be safe.

I'm *assuming* the fish bones are included in this? Or not?
Yes, fish bones should be included if possible.

We're not at the fish stage yet of raw (chicken is going awesome!), but definitely interested when we reach that point. I just don't know what to/how to properly order it from our local butcher.
For some reason, a good number of dogs just plain don't like fish. So getting them to eat it is a bit of a problem. My dog included. We went the tough love route for probably 5 days before we just decided to go with canned fish (which she DOES like. Go figure:confused:).

I would hold off on ordering fish in bulk until you know your dog likes it. Just get a little bit at first and go from there. Good luck!!
 

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There is a difference in the omega-3's in flaxseed versus fish. Flaxseed oil is mostly the omega-3 ALA which animals' bodies must then convert to EPA and DHA to be useful. Salmon oil already contains high levels of EPA and DHA so the omega-3's are more bio-available. Also high quality salmon oil has additional antioxidants called astaxanthin.

My preference for feeding raw fish at the moment is U.S. farm raised whole trout. When I can find them they are decently priced and I love eating them too. Often I will cut off the heads and tails to freeze for my dog and cook the rest for me.

Here are some links to help you find fish that are low in toxins like mercury and PCBs:
List of Seafood Health Alerts - Seafood Selector - Environmental Defense Fund
NRDC: Mercury Contamination in Fish - Consumer Guide to Mercury in Fish
 

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Also, how to feed the egg? My dog has quite a beard and a liquid egg would be messy... What if I cook it slightly?
I just hand my dog the whole egg, shell and all. It's funny watching him pick it up in his mouth and move it over to his crate pad. Usually he ends up dropping it so a little hole cracks in the shell, and he just licks the contents out of the shell and then eats the shell. Maybe you can try cracking a quarter-sized hole in the shell and let him eat clean it out. They usually lick it up so fast that you don't even see any spillage :smile: Or maybe you can try cracking the egg over his raw meal.
 
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