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Discussion Starter #1
Haven't been around here for a few weeks--but seeing more people going raw and getting the advice to make things work. Needing advice myself.

Thought I had things figured out-- well 3 out of 4 are pretty well full on 4 different meat types and as much variety of organ as I can find. Just have to reduce a bit more of the bone and up the meat and they are set.

The one that isn't set is Pax. After 4 weeks of notes this is what I've found.
Absolutely no beef is possible regardless the size big or small. Even the bloody juice from a flank steak will cause him to vomit 3-5 minutes later. He will not re-eat a meal with any beef and started to refuse any meal with even a hint of beef or beef juice. Same thing occurs with canned food with beef in it.

Pork is not quite as bad. He can keep pork down, but only if there is 2-3 days between each pork meal. Two days back to back of 2 ozs approx., the 2nd day comes back. The pork meal tho, he will re-eat. Still have to figure out a portion that does not cause him problems

I have tried dehydrated beef organ as a treat-- started to eat but couldn't keep it down-- now he refuses it. Beginning to believe that any red meat will be in very very small amounts and some not at all.

Going to finish testing out pork but my question for you experienced feeders is.......

chicken and turkey enough variety and what about non-liver organ needs?

The good news is that our new addition, Sydney another deaf boxer who is 14weeks old, takes to her weekend raw meals like a pro. Just doing weekends right now for our convenience but within a month or so she'll be full time.
 

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Pax the problem dog started the end of January. Wolfie and Zeke mid December and Bailey started the same time as Pax. Wolfie, Zeke, Bailey have had no runs, the occassional softie poo but nothing a slightly more boney next meal didn't fix. No frantic get me outside. Bailey did get a bit ambitious at the beginning and have to bring things back for a 2nd round, but that is pretty much gone also. Pax is also a very deliberate cruncher.

So for about 8-9 weeks it has been try a red meat- vomit-rest for a couple of days on chicken only or chicken with livers and no problem. Each time I re-introduce a red meat, beef immediately causes a problem. Pork will cause a problem if fed 24 hours apart.

The big thing I've noticed, is that he will now refuse to eat any meal that has any smell/taste of beef attached to it.
 

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Chicken and turkey only is enough variety even though the more protein sources you have the better. I know people who only feed chicken and their dogs are fine. Have you tried feeding fish? It sounds like your one dog is sensitive to red meats, which typically are more rich.

Liver is the bare essential organ meat to feed so as long as you feed liver your dogs are covered nutritionally. Of course it is better to feed other organs like kidney and pancreas but not essential. You might try different kinds of liver since your one dog doesn't do well with beef, it makes sense that he wouldn't handle beef liver well. Maybe try chicken or turkey livers.
 

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I'm a firm believer that a raw diet consisting of only chicken, liver, and kidney is better than ANY kibble on the market. It is, of course, not ideal and the more variety, the better!

I'd give fish a shot. I know some raw feeders opt to have their dog's raw diet fish based with good results.

50% of my dog's diet is chicken. It's how we keep it affordable.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
We have done fish also, but generally canned mackeral that I soak for awhile to try to remove excess salt.

On liver he does also do turkey liver with no problem.

I'm pretty certain that beef is out for a long time. About three weeks ago I found a place to buy whole beef hearts for just a bit over $1/lb. For the other three these has been a very cheap way to give them beef and bring the bone % down close to desired. I gave Pax a SMALL SLIVER, maybe the size of a quarter, and it came back up a couple of minutes later. Tried a very small round or flank steak piece a couple of times again after that and thats when the refusal to eat anything beef has touched started.

I thought that eating even a non-varied meat diet would be better than kibble but was concerned about the non-liver organ part- ways to get his bone % down- and that certain meats will provide a differant profile. Gone to stripping the bone out of a chicken breast to help on the bone%. The excess bones then go to the other 3 when they get very rich meal of a lot of beef heart.

Gotta a feeling that the boxer pup will be much easier to switch than he has been. When fixing everyones meals, she is giving me that look of a wild eyed
amazement at what she smells.
 

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I can solve one problem for you. Don't feed pork two days in a row. There ... problem solved. :smile:

I am real confused about the dog not being able to handle beef. Have you tried venison? Rabbit? Goat? I wonder if he would have problems with these. Another thing that confuses me is that he throws up, not diarrhea. What form are you feeding the beef in? ground? "chunks"? Steaks?
 

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Discussion Starter #9
RFD--Yeah--figured the pork will have to be every other day etc.

I have tried beef heavy canned foods--some Merrick and Evo--no go

The beef has been in form of flank or round steak--nothing ground and have tried as small pieces and also large pieces. Did the small pieces as a starter to transition and not meals in a row etc. Went to larger pieces 4-6 oz cuts when I was thinking that he wasn't "chewing" them enough. Neither worked.

He does not get diarrhea that I have seen. In cleaning the yard every 3-4 days we barely even find any softie poo piles and this is with 3 other adult dogs on raw and a new pup still on kibble mostly.

I have the pleasure of watching each dog have a bowel movement a couple of times a week. They seem to like to do their thing in front of the sun porch windows but thankfully out in the yard area.

Rabbit is next on my list for everyone to try. Goat is very hard to find here. Even the greek/lebanese stores do not carry it. Lamb is $$ here at 4-6/pound

Bratinna88- beginning to think he is a bird dog. He is probably a cross between a black lab and golden retriever --definetly bird dogs.

Just when I was so close to having everyone on the same page.
 

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why not just put him back on chicken and turkey for a month...let the association between meat and the smell of meat go away...

he may well be reacting to the smell because it makes him vomit....so remove the red meat...keep him on that which he eats happily...including the turkey liver...

give him the pork every two days if he tolerates that...and then re introduce meat down the line.

i think dogs can associate something that made them uncomfortable.....so they avoid it...anything that has made a dog throw up consistently.....i'd just start over with him.

you live in michigan...there are co ops there....where you can maybe get different cuts of meat (venison, goat, etc. )on the cheap.

http://dogfoodchat.com/forum/raw-feeding/1647-raw-feeding-co-op-list.html
 
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