[rockymtsweetie82]

I saw in a recent post that dogs don't have thoughts of being angry therefore displaying bad behavior. My dogs are very well in the house. They don't chew things up, poo/pee inside, and don't jump on things (ie: Counter). But when my husband would go out for work for 2-3 weeks at a time, Mako, our youngest at 6 months at the time, would poo, pee, chew to destroy, and jump up at my counter. Even though I was still here. It stopped immediately when my husband came home. Then, I went on a trip with my children for a month, leaving hubby home with the dogs. Mako acted out again. Doing the same things as when hubby was gone. And he doesn't do it anymore, now that we're both home all the time. I can't believe that dogs don't have feelings of abandonment, anger, disappointment. Have you ever looked in a dog's eyes when they're begging you to get on your lap and you say no? There eyes change to a sad little look that breaks your heart. They're either great con artists of the heart, or they can think like that. :biggrin: Just so everyone knows this is just my opinion, these are just my personal thoughts and how I view animals, and I'm not asking for help. Thanks!

 

[TippysMom]

I absolutely agree with you! I don't think we give dogs enough credit for thought and emotion. Their facial expressions change, their body language changes, they act out like children (and some adults), their eyes definately change. They know.

My husband has some health issues. When he's not well, my dogs are very gentle and loving with him. They know before he does sometimes.

I have seen anger, fear, concern, love (unconditional love!!), happiness, curiousity, and many other moods / emotions on my dogs faces. You can't tell me they don't think and feel as much as we do. They just don't have opposible thumbs and can't speak our language.

 

[RawFedDogs]

You can't tell me they don't think and feel as much as we do. They just don't have opposible thumbs and can't speak our language.

I never said they don't have emotions. They definately do. The part about "don't think like that" is revenge or "getting back at". They don't do things like that.

They don't poop in the floor just to make you sorry you treated them "bad". They don't tear up a pillow to get revenge. They don't chew a hole in the wall just to get back at you.

Oh, BTW: They aren't nearly as smart as us. Their thoughts and memory are very basic.

 

[TippysMom]

I never said they don't have emotions. They definately do. The part about "don't think like that" is revenge or "getting back at". They don't do things like that.

They don't poop in the floor just to make you sorry you treated them "bad". They don't tear up a pillow to get revenge. They don't chew a hole in the wall just to get back at you.

Oh, BTW: They aren't nearly as smart as us. Their thoughts and memory are very basic.

I disagree with you, and think it sad that you don't give them enough credit.

 

[PeanutsMommy]

rockymtsweetie82 from your avatar it looks like you have ABPTs I think that its definately something that they do more then other breeds my boy (hes 8 months) does it to me all the time he never chews up anything misbehaves if i leave him for even a few hours he will show me he is mad at me for "ditching him" by getting on the couch and clearing off my chelf but not destory anything just leave me a mess to show me he was mad.

 

[Rexandbaby]

I sometimes believe that dogs are smarter than most people!:biggrin:

 

[Rescue Squad]

I have to say that dogs don't have human characteristics in their thought processes. They don't seek revenge and don't hold a grudge. Yes they do have an emotional attachment to us but it's driven by instinct and pack values rather than human personalities. Thinking that animals think and act like humans is called anthropomorphism

Anthropomorphism
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John Tenniel's depiction of this anthropomorphic rabbit was featured in the first chapter of Lewis Carroll's Alice's Adventures in WonderlandAnthropomorphism is the attribution of uniquely human characteristics to non-human creatures and beings, natural and supernatural phenomena, material states and objects or abstract concepts. Subjects for anthropomorphism commonly include animals and plants depicted as creatures with human motivation able to reason and converse, forces of nature such as winds or the sun, components in games, unseen or unknown sources of chance, etc. Almost anything can be subject to anthropomorphism. The term derives from a combination of the Greek ἄνθρωπος (ánthrōpos), "human" and μορφή (morphē), "shape" or "form".

Humans seem to have an innate capacity to project human characteristics in this way. Evidence from art and artifacts suggests it is a long-held propensity that can be dated back to earliest times. It is strongly associated with the art of storytelling where it also appears to have ancient roots. Most cultures possess a long-standing fable tradition with anthropomorphised animals as characters that can stand as commonly recognised types of human behaviour. The use of such literature to draw moral conclusions can be highly complex.

Within these terms, humans have more recently been identified as having an equivalent opposite propensity to deny common traits with other species - most particularly apes - as part of a feeling that humans are unique and special. This tendency has been referred to as Anthropodenial by primatologist Frans de Waal.


We tend to want them to be our babies and make them so by giving them human characteristics that are not present. Dogs are dogs and cats are cats they act simply from their inherited primal instinct rather than human thought processes.

Hugs to all

 

[rockymtsweetie82]

I can't just accept that a dog is a dog and a cat is a cat. Each dog is different in the way he/she presents herself as well as any cat. Some cats are more independant, others prefer to be with someone at all times. Dogs know when you're leaving the house before you do, they tear up your stuff if you don't take them, and they yell out a warning when a stranger comes near. I think there are a lot of people out there who think dogs and cats are much less intelligent than we give them credit for. I, for one, choose to believe that all living things are equal and can feel and process thoughts just like the rest of us.

 

[PeanutsMommy]

^^^ i agree. my dog does things at times that have nothing to do with instinct. i dont think instinct tells him when he is left alone to climb the furniture and clear off the shelf, but not destroy anything run around and scream (yes i have been told he makes almost a paniced screaming sound when i leave) until he falls asleep. IMO that is an animal acting out of emotion not insctinct he doesnt do those things when i or other people are with him

 

[Rescue Squad]

Woah! Wait a minute... I never said that dogs and cats can't have different personalities. They can and do. I never said that dogs and cats can't puzzle things out for themselves because they can and do. What I did say is they dont feel jealousy, don't harbor thoughts of revenge and don't by nature plot to get even... That is all.....

 

[rockymtsweetie82]

I believe a dog DOES feel jealousy. You bring in a new animal and pay attention to it more than the one that was there first and they start acting out or push their way to your hands. Jealous. Just like a kid. Or a husband. Maybe they don't harbor thoughts of revenge but they certainly act in revenge when they don't get what they want. And they might not plot to get even, but they certainly try to get even.

 

[rannmiller]

This behavior of "revenge" you guys are describing sounds a lot like separation anxiety to me. JMO

 

[Rexandbaby]

What about if you are patting one dog, and the other just has to put its nose in? Is that jealousy? If I pat one of mine and the other feels left out, and pushes its way in, and you being human push it away, and then something bad happens...............

 

[rannmiller]

What happens? When that happens with my dogs, the other dog learns to wait its turn until I'm done the the first dog. Then I give the other dog attention (one on one attention is very important in a multiple dog family, IMO). I'm sure you could call it jealousy, or just them wanting whatever good thing is being handed out. For example: when i see a whole bunch of people getting free pizza, I immediately want the free pizza too. Because it is good, not because I'm jealous of the people getting it. And do I get to run to the front of the line, shove the person ahead of me aside and get my pizza first? No, I wait in line and get pizza when its my turn. Some people may try to "cut" in line because they want the good stuff first, but they always get reprimanded and sent to the back to wait their turn. That's what I think it's like.

Again, I'm not saying dogs and cats don't have their own individual personalities and they're all very different, but they - like people - are all very similar too. Humans all act out of "human nature" just like dogs and cats out of their own nature.

 

[TippysMom]

I never said that they had human characteristics. I said they can think and feel emotions.

Also, Wikipedia is not reliable information - anyone can create a page and enter anything they want to there.

My dogs are not my "babies", but they are part of my family. The best part about them - they don't judge.

 

[rannmiller]

Well I certainly will agree that dogs think and feel emotions, just not the full range like humans do (though sometimes I question humans too, hehe). My dogs are my low maintenance children and I love them very much.

 

[domari]

I never said they don't have emotions. They definately do. The part about "don't think like that" is revenge or "getting back at". They don't do things like that.

They don't poop in the floor just to make you sorry you treated them "bad". They don't tear up a pillow to get revenge. They don't chew a hole in the wall just to get back at you.

Oh, BTW: They aren't nearly as smart as us. Their thoughts and memory are very basic.

So what explains why they do things that seem to be for spite? We have one that will pee or poop on the floor when we leave the house, even though she went outside just before we left. It really seems like she does it on purpose. Maybe she has some other reason for it, but I have no clue why.

 

[domari]

What about if you are patting one dog, and the other just has to put its nose in? Is that jealousy? If I pat one of mine and the other feels left out, and pushes its way in, and you being human push it away, and then something bad happens...............

I have six dogs and two of them try to be the center of attention. One who has separation anxiety will even get between my husband and I. If my husband and I hug or get close to each other, the dog will run over and put himself between us begging for attention.
Another dog does it too, but I think she's just getting her nosy body in closer because she thinks there might be treats involved and wants to get there first.

 

[RawFedDogs]

We have one that will pee or poop on the floor when we leave the house, even though she went outside just before we left.

Of course I'm not there and wasn't there when she was potty trained but it could be that instead of learning "don't potty in the house", it's possible that she she somehow got the message "don't potty in the house when humans are home."

It's not unusual for newly potty trained puppies to get the message "don't potty in front of humans" and they will go elsewhere in the house and potty. That doesn't sound like your case but the first story above could be.

 

[domari]

Of course I'm not there and wasn't there when she was potty trained but it could be that instead of learning "don't potty in the house", it's possible that she she somehow got the message "don't potty in the house when humans are home."

It's not unusual for newly potty trained puppies to get the message "don't potty in front of humans" and they will go elsewhere in the house and potty. That doesn't sound like your case but the first story above could be.

She's 5 years old now and we didn't have any problem housebreaking her, she's just weird!
She also has the message not to go potty anywhere in the house except the kitchen floor, which is better than going on the carpets. I figured she pees on the kitchen floor because that's where the back door is and where she used to pee when she was a puppy and couldn't hold it long enough to go outside.

If I shut the gate to the kitchen when we leave and she has full run of the house, she won't pee on the floor at all. It's only if we forget to close the gate, then we come home to find a mess on the kitchen floor. What really bugs me is we always let the dogs out before we leave, they all pee outside then come back inside.

The only other issue we have with her that might have something to do with it, is she fights with the other two females so we have to always keep them separated. Maybe she's going into the kitchen to mark it because the other two girls can't go in there when we're gone. Maybe it's done as revenge to the other dogs because when we're not home she wants to be the alpha dog.